Enterprise: Twilight 11/05: Hot or Not?

[RustySlinky]

There's actually some good buzz going into tonight's episode at AICN's site: People at other Trek sites are calling this one good.

It be neat to see how many are watching it here, and what we think of it compared with mainstream Trekkers.

[vhsiv]

s

P

O

I

L

E

R


S

P

A

C

E













So, in the first 5 minutes, they did a recap of the 'Odyssey 5' pilot, Captain Quark gets/has a 'Memento'-style memory disorder, and by :20 they've reimagined Enterpise as 'Battlestar Galactica' - the last Earth ship leading a convoy of humans to a new home someplace. All of this is intercut with scenes from 'The Locket' where Quark and... Well, just T'Pol looks back upon the life that they've shared together on the new settlement. But she looks a lot better with the pony-tail. Oooh, and facial hair for Reed - is that regulation?

Is this going someplace or are they just going to hit the 'reset' button at the end of the hour?

In all, it's probably one of the better Series Finales I've seen in a while. Has it already been seven years already? My, how time flies when you become indifferrent...

Sorry about my plot 'batching' - I just got back from seeing 'Matrix Revolutions', where I felt as if I was revisiting every science-fiction film I ever saw, from 'Alien' to 'Star Wars' to 'The Terminator' to, well 'The Matrix'.

Uh-oh - here comes the reset button... If they can eliminate the 'temporal virus' from Quantum's head, the past 12 years won't have occurred? Their grade has just taken a drastic slide - just when I thought the series was drawing to a 'proper' close, and I was getting used to the long-haired T'Pol, they up and ruin everything with a quick 'out' clause - I think we're headed toward C+/D territory here...

What a cop-out. I hear the distant sound of flushing toilets. And next week's 'Western' episode doesn't look particularly promising either...

[Zantar]

that show has certainly not been 7 years running. This is third season...

[trubador]

SEMI-SPOILER















The movie "Memento" meets FS:The Locket meets the ST:TNG ep with Picard living a lifetime within a few hours... all with weak CGI. (*yawn*... hoo-hum)

[vhsiv]

Originally posted by Zantar
that show has certainly not been 7 years running. This is third season... Zantar - I know it's the third season - it was a joke, wishful thinking or a combination of the two.

I might add that B&B were also quoting from 'Voyager's Series Finale - that probably why I had such a strong reaction to it. To wit, I wish it was the Series Finale, b/c the reset button is used as a gimmick and a plot device for an episode that would have otherwise done a lot in the way of plot and character development: For ONCE, all of the actors seemed comfortable with their roles, and all of the forced angst of the show was out of the picture.

I dunno, I could go on like this for a while, but B&B haven't earned my respect, so I'll leave it at that, though I thought it was interesting twist given what happened to the ship at the end of the episode - shades of 'Nemesis'...

[RustySlinky]

. . . ST:TNG ep with Picard living a lifetime within a few hours...Reference to the excellent episode "All Good Things" from 1994.

Another piece of trivia: "All Good Things" was also one TV episode which beat out these four other motion pictures to snag the Hugo Award that following year:

Interview With the Vampire
The Mask (Jim Carrey)
Stargate (The motion picture)
Star Trek: Generations

The episode was written by Brannon Braga and:
Ron D. Moore - of the upcoming new Battlestar Galactica Mini.

[ipimen]

Originally posted by RustySlinky
Reference to the excellent episode "All Good Things" from 1994.

Or maybe the one called "The Inner Light" from S5.

Sometimes i wonder if you criticize just for the fun of it ;)

I found this episode to be quite good, a lot better than a lot of Enterprise episodes lately. Yes, maybe there's a rehash of some other shows or some other Treks, but c'mon give them some credit. The episode was well told and the story was interesting, at least it kept me interested until the end. Maybe i'm not as critic as some or i'm just happy if i'm entertained but i have to say that i liked this one :)

[B Sharp]

s



p



o



i



l



e



r



s





the only thing that briefly had my interest was the scene showing the destruction of the earth, but as was said in another post, the CGI was not exactly world-class. And T'Pol did look nice with the ponytail, and they did manage to show (rather than tell) how the relationship had changed over 12 years. A decent effort by writers and actors, until the last 10 minutes...

but the resolution reminded me more of Dallas and Bobby's dream sequence than of the STNG or hoary old sci-fi cliche plots. Well, actually, there was one sci-fi parallel: my wife said "hey, is this the part where Archer takes a quantum leap?" It was like the writers wrote themselves into a corner in order to keep it 'edgy', and then scrambled to have it sort of make sense because time was up...

All in all, mostly a bore.

[SeasonOfDeath]

Originally posted by vhsiv
s

P

O

I

L

E

R


S

P

A

C

E










And next week's 'Western' episode doesn't look particularly promising either...

Hmm.. has this theme been done in Trek before?... oh, yes..

ST:TOS "Spectre of the Gun "
ST:TNG "A Fist Full of Datas"

Hmmm where else has this been done?.. Ahh would that be
"FireFly"?

Yaaaaawn. So much for originality.

[TechnoBoY]

I'm watching the repeat on Saturday.

[who45]

It held my interest in the beginning then lost it somewhere near the middle.

[RustySlinky]

Mike Sussman, solo writer for the episode *Twllight* (the same episode being discussed in this thread) did a Q & A chat with Enterprise fans at Trekweb.com last night. Here’s the link and some excerpts from the session:

S
P
O
I
L
E
R

W
A
R
N
I
N
G
S

The link to the full chat session is here: http://trekweb.com/articles/2003/11/07/3fab368522b54.shtml

Selected Excerpts:

Dex asks: I really enjoyed "Twilight", as I thought that episode was extremely well executed consistently on all fronts. However, the one gripe I have is that Archer not remembering anything. I was wondering why you wrote it like that. Thanks

MikeSussman: Hmmm..."Archer not remembering anything" was really the basic idea for the show. The central notion was that someone with Alzheimer's disease, in some ways, could be thought of as a time-traveller...

(cut)

Htown asks: I think twilight is the best episode of Enterprise yet. However, once again Ensign Mayweather was given nothing to do. He got a single line, then died with no acknowlegement of his passing. For your next script, can you please give Travis something to do? :)

MikeSussman: Travis is a fine character and we could certainly find more for him to do. I know it must be frustrating for some of the other actors since most of ours scripts focus on Archer, T'Pol and Trip. Travis initially had more to do in "Twilight," but I screwed up. He was in the teaser and some other scenes, but I had to write him out after I realized he was already "dead". I'd hoped the impact of his death would underscore the dire nature of their situation. It wasn't meant as a slight to the character or to Anthony. We killed off the entire crew, after all... but I agree Travis may have died too soon.

(cut)

SteveKrutzler: Someone mentioned the Vulcans earlier and in "Twilight" I noticed that Soval seemed rather uncaring or unconcerned at the fact that a neighboring planet of a 100-year ally had just been completely obliterated. Was there any discussion of this decision or did it come out the way you envisioned it?

MikeSussman: I'm sure they were very concerned. At one point, we considered showing a Vulcan cruiser making a valiant last stand at Earth. And we did establish that they were trying to aid the Earth convoys. If Soval seemed "uncaring," it may have been that Earth had been destroyed many months prior. He was now concerned about the convoys... and more specifically, T'Pol.

(cut)

SteveKrutzler: Mike will still take "Twilight" questions... Here is a question that is a follow-up on an earlier one and many people have asked a similar version so I'll ask it directly... There was a clear hint at a T'Pol/Archer intimacy in "Twilight." Are there any plans to take this further? Is romance in the air or will this always be only a tease?

MikeSussman: Maybe they'll release the NC-17 version on DVD... We left it open-ended, but if there was intimacy, I don't think there was a lot of it. Just my opinion. I think T'Pol was stuck on Ceti Alpha for twelve years... she goes into heat once every seven years... ...just a matter of doing the math. ;)

(cut)

Jadzia-Dax asks: Mike - was Archer's "You'd make a good Nurse" comment at the end of "Twilight" a nod to TOS?

MikeSussman: Er... no. :) There were plenty of TOS "nods" in that show without people making up their own . . .

PS: There's a good deal more of this at the link above. I think he dodges some of the questions.

[Harvey'schurl]

but then the ending was so predicatable.

Of course everything has to be perfectly fine when they fix Archer. It would have been more interesting if he had remants of that future. Would it make him more daring? Would his relationship change with T'Pol? No instead they make it all nice and happy.

I really don't feel the Xindi threat at all and if they have a future guy wouldn't they know a lot of the things that have happend so far and be there trying to stop the crew everythime they turn around.

[BillFrugge]

Originally posted by Zantar
that show has certainly not been 7 years running. This is third season...

It just seems like it's been that long...

In my area, the show must be on at 1:00 Sunday morning. At least that's when I finaly found this program...

At the end of the hour, all of the characters were lucky: They never had to endure the episode, while we will have to try and forget it.

As to running repeats of other Star Trek stories, that's how they keep the Star Trek atmosphere. It's a long tradition going back to ST:TNG - The Naked Now. (episode 1x02?)

[RustySlinky]

Originally posted by RustySlinky
. . . It be neat to see how many are watching it here, and what we think of it compared with mainstream Trekkers. Thanks to everyone who took the time out to check out the episode!!!
:multi::multi::multi::multi::multi::multi::multi:
As of 12 midnite Pacific time: Here's the latest feedback from two of the big Trek sites:

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/203614/Trekwebtwilightpoll.jpghttp://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/203614/treknationtwilightpoll.jpg

There's a huge difference here between how Scapers rated this episode, and how the online-Trek fans felt about it!

Over the 3 seasons which Enterprise has aired, there had always been a vocal segment of Trekkies trashing the show online. What is distinctive about this episode in particular is how the fans came together to praise this one. Almost all of them could agree on liking an episode. People were posting that this one was way up there with the best of the *Next Gen* episodes, and they were crying at the end and all, etc.

Actually, I think it's encouraging that most of the Scaper criticism leveled at *Twilight* were comments about not having originality and having seen it all before! And that's a'ight because Scapers and Trekkies want different things from their TV, I guess. If Trekkies wanna consume basic staples like chicken, beef, fish, pork, and eggs - Broil em, fry em, roast em, grill em, whatever but do make sure it's still chicken, beef, fish . . .

OTOH, Scapers wanna keep reachin' for that new and exotic, like tofu burgers, buffalo steaks, crocodile kabobs and ostrich eggs. :wb:

It's November Sweeps Month now, and *Enterprise* is getting battered by *Smallville*, both series going head-to-head. The people behind *Enterprise* know that it is do-or-die now, so before the show aired last week, "hints" were being dropped that this particular episode would be a goodie.

Approximately one year ago *MediaSavant* said that when two genre shows are scheduled against each other, one will usually push the other out of the time slot. So right now, the show with the lower Nielsens is still *Enterprise*.

----------

Links to TrekNation Feedback on *Twilight*:
Poll Data: http://www.treknation.com/episodes/season3/twilight.shtml#poll
Commentary Threads: http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB28&Number=2008931&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=7&fpart=all&vc=1

Links to TrekWeb Feedback on *Twilight*:
Poll Data: http://trekweb.com/polls/vote.php?pid=3fa8e4c755594&results=1
Commentary Threads: http://trekweb.com/articles/2003/11/06/3faa30a44b964.shtml
-
-

[vhsiv]

Hey, Rusty - I was lurking on the TrekWeb site a while back, and it seemed that the majority of folks there were convinced that Berman and Braga could do no wrong - they came out positive for everything they did - I seem to recall someone saying that 'Raiijin' was the best thing since sliced bread, etc., etc. ad infinitum.

And I disagree with your food analogy - 'Enterprise' is 'knockers & mash', refried beans and boiled chicken - a frozen tv dinner. 'Farscape' is just proper cuisine... liver, fava beans and a nice chianti... maybe some monkey-brains on the side...

bwhahaha.....

[RustySlinky]

Hey, Rusty - I was lurking on the TrekWeb site a while back, and it seemed that the majority of folks there were convinced that Berman and Braga could do no wrong - they came out positive for everything they did - I seem to recall someone saying that 'Raiijin' was the best thing since sliced bread, etc., etc. ad infinitum.

And I disagree with your food analogy - 'Enterprise' is 'knockers & mash', refried beans and boiled chicken - a frozen tv dinner. 'Farscape' is just proper cuisine... liver, fava beans and a nice chianti... maybe some monkey-brains on the side...

bwhahaha.....:rollin::rollin::rollin::rollin::roll in:
Excellent point(s) *vhsiv*!!!

Yup, many of the people hanging out there do indeed seem to like the Beavis and - (err) - I meant Berman and Braga show. Episodes like *Rajiin* do have its supporters. (Rajiin was the episode about the freed sex slave who later wreaks havoc onboard the Enterprise.)

Check out these Trekweb poll results for *Rajiin* and *Twilight*, side by side:

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/203614/Trekwebrajiinpoll.jpghttp://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/203614/Trekwebtwilightpoll.jpg

For *Rajiin*, approx. 10 % did not like the episode, and another 10% only thought it was average. Their displeasure also showed up in the commentary threads: http://trekweb.com/stories.php?aid=3f7d5787d2760

But the Episode *Twilight* even seemed to satisfy the *unhappies*. While it is true that a few other *Enterprise* episodes did generate similarly curved graphs, *Twilight*'s is the most extremely skewed in this manner. The voting turnout is heavy for this one, and there's a fair amount of fan-gushing going on that's not modus-operandi for these guys.

------

:rollin::rollin::rollin:
OTOH, *Lava's a Many Splendored Thing* does seems to go along with chianti? *Heaves*
:rollin::rollin::rollin:

[B Sharp]

Originally posted by RustySlinky
[b] ...OTOH, Scapers wanna keep reachin' for that new and exotic, like tofu burgers, buffalo steaks, crocodile kabobs and ostrich eggs. :wb:

.


Mmmmmmm, yummy! I just love a good ostrich burger topped with an ostrich egg (over easy). I'll pass on the croc- just too chewy.