Zero Patience for Zero Tolerance

[NebariNookiee]

Zero Patience for Zero Tolerance
Tuesday, November 25, 2003 By Wendy McElroy
News shows recently showed video of 14 police officers charging a crowded high-school corridor with guns drawn in a drug sweep. Students at Stratford Creek High School in Goose Creek, S.C., were forced onto their knees or against walls, while dogs sniffed their backpacks for drugs.

None were found. Although the incident was extreme, it was not an aberration but the logical consequences of "zero tolerance" policies, defended by both the school and the police. Zero tolerance must be abandoned, especially in connection with children.

Zero-tolerance policies have resulted in some children being placed in the criminal justice system. Two examples currently in the news: A Missouri judge ruled that a 6-year-old boy suspected of killing his grandfather could be charged as an adult; a New Jersey prosecutor's office has charged a 7-year-old boy with molesting a 5-year-old girl in an incident that the defense attorney describes as "playing doctor."

For most children, zero tolerance is experienced in schools with administrative rules that purportedly enforce safety and discipline. Arguably, the administrative rules are actually a reaction to federal threats to cut funds. For example, in 1994 Congress passed the Gun-Free School Act by which states had to implement zero tolerance on weapons or lose federal money. Many schools rigorously interpreted zero tolerance to include the prohibition of anything even looking like a weapon. They adopted broad definitions of dangerous behavior, which allowed for no exceptions.

Soon the media spilled over with stories of young children being suspended or treated like felons for playing with water pistols, paper guns or even for pointing their fingers at each other and saying "bang."

The punishment for possessing an obvious toy became the same as for possessing a real weapon because zero tolerance means zero distinctions. Zero tolerance takes discretion and evaluation away from educators and mandates responses that can be wildly inappropriate. Behavior that used to be corrected by detention or a trip to the principal's office now receives suspension, expulsion or even police involvement. What used to be the last resort has become the first and only option.

In Madison, Wis., Chris Schmidt, a sixth-grader with a spotless record, faced a year's suspension because he brought a kitchen knife to school for a science project. Asked about the case, Valencia Douglas, an assistant superintendent of schools in Madison, said, "We can't say, 'You're a good kid, so your mistake doesn't have as much force, or importance behind it.'"

And so, an 11-year-old is taken away in handcuffs for drawing a picture of a gun; an 8-year-old faces expulsion for a keychain that contained a cheap nail clipper; a fifth-grader is suspended for drawing the World Trade Center being hit by an airplane ... The stories go on and on.

The quantity of these incidents illustrates that the vicious consequences of zero tolerance are not isolated events. They are embedded into one of the most important institutions of society: the educational system. When the school principal in Goose Creek justified police pointing guns at innocent students, he did so by saying he would use "any means" to keep his school "clean."

A backlash is developing among students who are reportedly saying the same thing nationwide. Many schools now resemble prisons with hidden security cameras, metal detectors, guards, random searches, drug-sniffing dogs, and searches without warrants.

Zero tolerance is commonly justified on the grounds of children's safety. But, in studying "unsafe" schools that had enforced zero-tolerance policies for four years, the National Center for Education Statistics found little change (Skiba & Peterson, 1999).

In commenting on the study in the journal "National Association of Elementary School Principals," Roger W. Ashford wrote, "The study concludes, however, that even though there is little data to prove the effectiveness of zero-tolerance policies, such initiatives serve to reassure the public that something is being done to ensure safety. Therefore, the popularity of zero-tolerance policies may have less to do with their actual effect than the image they portray of schools taking harsh measures to prevent violence. Whether the message actually changes student behavior may be less important than the reassurance it provides to administrators, teachers and parents."

Everyone recognizes that zero-tolerance policies were developed in response to legitimate concerns, such as those raised by the high-school shootings at Columbine. But, increasingly, people are also recognizing that zero tolerance creates as many -- and perhaps more -- problems than the original difficulties they were meant to solve.

Alternatives are being suggested. For example, Richard L. Curwin and Allen N. Mendler have co-authored a book entitled "As Tough as Necessary: Countering Aggression, Violence, and Hostility in Schools" (Association for Supervision and Curriculum Development, 1999). They advocate a wide range of responses to school violence, which depend upon an evaluation of the circumstances surrounding each incident. The responses include "counseling, restitution, behavioral planning, behavior rehearsal, suspension with training or educational experience, and police referral."

Another alternative is homeschooling.

There is little evidence that zero tolerance produces safety. Instead, it strips away the safeguards of a peaceful society: compassion, due process, good will, presumption of innocence, tolerance, discretion, humor ... It victimizes the most vulnerable citizens: children.

[Selena]

The irony is that kids at school can't play many of the games that are normal for young children to play but 'big kids' (teens and adults) are free to create havoc in the community and terrorize neighborhoods.
If there's zero tolerance for firearms in school then it's a trend that should extend to all parts of society ... no guns in shcools, homes, businesses, etc. But just try to get that one past the NRA.

[BlackThorn]

Pretty soon, it will be that schools can expel students by reason of suspicion -- no proof, no actual crime, just we think they might do that, and poof they're gone.

[NYPinTA]

Common sense has gone the way of the Dodo bird. :rolleyes:

[Lord Loser]

Yeah, clubbed in the head by imbeciles...

[NebariNookiee]

Originally posted by BlackThorn
Pretty soon, it will be that schools can expel students by reason of suspicion -- no proof, no actual crime, just we think they might do that, and poof they're gone.
Sure, why not? Our government already does that -- so why can't schools adopt the same policy?

[StephX]

Someone needs to send these principals to logic/common sence class. Do these schools get into trouble for doing stupid things like terrorizing children with swat teams?

:eek3:

Man, how many of ya'll would have been dragged off in handcuffs in school if they had gone to one of these schools?

[NebariNookiee]

No -- but they loose their "government" funding by not adopting zero tolerence policies. They've been railroaded into it by "Uncle Scam"

[Kurt_eh]

Welcome to the "personal responsibility-LESS" society :(

[witchdoctor]

Originally posted by NebariNookiee
[B],,,,
Zero tolerance is commonly justified on the grounds of children's safety. But, in studying "unsafe" schools that had enforced zero-tolerance policies for four years, the National Center for Education Statistics found little change (Skiba & Peterson, 1999).

In commenting on the study in the journal "National Association of Elementary School Principals," Roger W. Ashford wrote, "The study concludes, however, that even though there is little data to prove the effectiveness of zero-tolerance policies, such initiatives serve to reassure the public that something is being done to ensure safety. Therefore, the popularity of zero-tolerance policies may have less to do with their actual effect than the image they portray of schools taking harsh measures to prevent violence. Whether the message actually changes student behavior may be less important than the reassurance it provides to administrators, teachers and parents."

Everyone recognizes that zero-tolerance policies were developed in response to legitimate concerns, such as those raised by the high-school shootings at Columbine. But, increasingly, people are also recognizing that zero tolerance creates as many -- and perhaps more -- problems than the original difficulties they were meant to solve.

,,,,,

There is little evidence that zero tolerance produces safety. Instead, it strips away the safeguards of a peaceful society: compassion, due process, good will, presumption of innocence, tolerance, discretion, humor ... It victimizes the most vulnerable citizens: children.

The problem is that people want quick easy solutions, and there usually aren't any.

And if you do implement a solution, you have to follow it up and see if it is actually working as intended. If not, then you have to back off, trying and figure out why the solution is not working and figure out something else to try.

I think this is indicative of an underlying trend in society in which people become fixated on punishment and revenge. In the long run, I do not believe such vindictiveness helps anyone, either the victim or society. Finding solutions that work does.

[Darth Buddha]

"Unencumbered by the Thought Process"

Originally posted by NYPinTA
Common sense has gone the way of the Dodo bird. :rolleyes:

Click and Clack meant unencumbered by the thought process as a joke... but sadly it is all too serious here. Over legislation and the removal of all discretionary enforcement by law and potential lawsuit (if they don't go to the max right away and it goes bad-- whammo -- massive lawsuits) is leading to children living in a police state.

Same is true of sexual harassment in the workplace (some places, "nice tie" is sexual harassment). There are more examples which I'm sure others can provide.

Legislations should pass a libertarian means test... do the MINIMUM to address the problem WITHOUT the cure being worse than the ill.

As to the lawsuits, I'm no conservative, but SOME sort of torte reform is necessary. Soon.

[Tiriel]

You know what I think is the scariest part about this? These kids will grow up thinking it's OK. Thinking that's the way it's supposed to be. Thinking that they have no rights and the school/government can do to them however they darn well please and they have no recourse. Thinking the state/government is the enemy and if they don't keep their heads down, their future is over. That's how you grow good "citizens" for a dictator-ship, but not responsible participants of a democracy. If you feel you do not count, you're not even going to try to change anything. Why vote? It's not like it's going to make a difference. Who knows, if you vote for the wrong thing, maybe the dogs and guns will come to your house...

I wonder how many geniuses they weed out early on this way...in my experience being highly intelligent rarely goes with conforming well.
The sad part is it seems to be happening all over the world. I know the rules were much stricter when my little brother went through school than when I did. Maybe we have crossed the point of no return and are sliding into decadence through mediocracy, by streamlining everything and everybody...

Just my personal opinion, of course :)

Love and Peace and :shocked:

Tiriel :bounce:

[Darth Buddha]

Quote from God Emperor of Dune

Frank Herbert
Most civilization is based on cowardice. It's so easy to civilize by teaching cowardice. You water down the standards which would lead to bravery. You restrain the will. You regulate the appetites. You fence in the horizons. You make a law for every movement. You deny the existence of chaos. You teach even the children to breathe slowly. You tame.

He's scarily on target, is he not?

[AgentSun]

a big problem here is that they're so afraid of another columbine that they think the best thing to do is to prevent it before it starts. and it has nothing to do with what they enforce or not enforce. simply enough, it needs to start with parents loving their children and taking care of them and LISTENING to them. nothing can change human behavior in the high school or even elementary school setting. the problem will remain as long as kids feel like they need to make fun of other kids. but their strategy is like "we're going to suspend you so you can't bring a toothpick into the class room cause you could've killed some people with that"...

they're not analyzing PEOPLE they're analyzing situations. i bet all of these kids are normal kids who really don't understand what they're in trouble for. i dont think their parents understand either. the REAL KILLERS are the ones that they don't notice because if they're going to kill some people they're not going to show up everyday with a gun in their backpack. they're assuming everyone who has a toothpick in their hand has the intention of murder. it's just not the same. not everyone is like that. they're going about the problem all wrong....and they can't scare the psycho out of someone, all they can do is make sure that these psychos get smarter. and they're possibly breeding these kids to hate the law enforcement that is supposed to keep them safe. after all, how would you feel about cops if you were 6 years old and a whole bunch of them burst into your school, guns pointed at you?

[BlackThorn]

Breeding smarter criminals, one suspension at a time.

What AgentSun said about these kids probably being normal sounds right on with some of the incidents listed in the article. Like the child drawing the picture of the plane crashing into the World Trade Center. That sounds like a child's normal reaction and way of processing what was a traumatic image to see in television. So what the school basically did was remove that child's safe method of dealing with seeing that, possibly forcing the child to bottle it up inside and have much greater problems in the future. Real nice.

And when the hell were nail clippers considered a weapon. What's the kid going to do? Manicure his/her fellow students to death?

[AgentSun]

And when the hell were nail clippers considered a weapon. What's the kid going to do? Manicure his/her fellow students to death?

well if that's the case, i think all notebook paper should be banned from schools. cause a kid with the intent to kill might papercut his fellow students to death.

[BlackThorn]

Why aren't they banning pens and pencils? I'd think those are much more lethal than nail clippers.

[NYPinTA]

That'll be next.
It is sad really. I would have been arrested 10 times over by my jr. prom!
If they want to prevent another Columbine maybe they should try and figure out how two kids can get to that point rather then 'lock down' every single school in the country.
My mother says all the time that maybe the people that get elected to the school boards should be the ones who had a hard time in school rather then those that didn't. (Apologies to all of the smarties here. :D ) But if you had to really work at getting the good grades it would probably be easier to then comprehend what it really takes for the next generation of kids to suceed rather then putting in place ridiculous expectations and then make them feel like it was the kids that failed.
.... or something....

[TechnoBoY]

Schools suck. Bleh. My school just added a whole bunch of new rules to a rulebook alread with about 70 pages worth of material.

[BlackThorn]

Ooo . . . Books too. Those school text books would make great blunt weapons, and a backpack full of them is downright lethal.

[AgentSun]

and desks. any 6 year old can pick one up and go WWF on another student.

and don't forget crayons...those are lethal.

[Third EYe]

I'm just shocked that this type of lunacy ever takes hold, you know, with all the voters and such.

[Mrelia]

Originally posted by Third EYe
I'm just shocked that this type of lunacy ever takes hold, you know, with all the voters and such.

Do you ever read the "Letters to the Editor" pages in the newspaper (especially those in small to moderate-size towns)? Those folks are voters, too.
:help:

[tribsaint]

I've had it with the no-tolerance thing at my school. Two examples:

Last year, I was sent to the school psychiatrist for a FULL psychiatric exam...because I had a scratch on my arm and one of my teachers thought I was trying to commit suicide. I work with animals and a day doesn't go BY without me getting scratched or bruised SOMEWHERE. They called my parents and wasted two hours of my time, finally letting me go because it was OBVIOUS that I wasn't suicidal.

This year, we had a new policy on Halloween: no costumes. It used to be fun for people to dress up and only a few took it out of hand. But because some did, they got rid of it all-together. Let's keep in mind that the week prior was "spirit week" and one of the days, they had us dressing up as cowboys for "spirit points" (and, being on my fourth year there, I still don't know what the frell spirit points are or what they're supposed to do).

Anyway, I thought it was a stupid and completely unfair rule to say that Halloween costumes caused a "distraction" in school when goth kids and kids with 2-foot green spiked mohawks could do whatever they wanted.

So I went to school completely goth.

Nobody noticed until my third hour, when my teacher sent me down to the principal's office.

I actually almost got suspended for that, but didn't because I had a clean record.




People being freaked out over every little thing is what the people that hate this country LIKE to see. We don't even NEED enemies anymore, we don't even trust ourselves.

[Mrelia]

Dontcha just LOVE double standards? Remember, HS doesn't last forever & you don't have so much of that crap in college.

Knowledge is is power.
Power corrupts.
Study hard.
Be Evil.

[Darth Buddha]

Originally posted by Mrelia
Dontcha just LOVE double standards? Remember, HS doesn't last forever & you don't have so much of that crap in college.

Even so, the crap in college is far worse now than when I first started to school. I arrived JUST as PC was first blooming. The change in even the four years to finish my first degree was astounding.

[tribsaint]

*shrug* I don't care, I just can't wait to get out of there.

Another weapon...plastic silverware in the cafeteria? I've been saying it all along...if some kid went off the deep end and decided to stab someone with one of those forks, it could just break in there. And those things are sharp...we've tested them.

But hey, it's okay to knock kids up full of Ritalin and send them off to learn themselves somethin' useful in a doped up state...

...but God forbid a pre-packaged Midol be given to a girl going through that cyclical pain...yeah, don't get me started on that. I know MANY people that got week-long suspensions for that.

[AgentSun]

we have metal silverware thank goodness! try cutting a bagel with plastic!

And those things are sharp...we've tested them.

maybe that's why they're giving kids plastic silverware...

is it still silverware if it's plastic? can it be plasticware?

[Scarran Raptor]

gee, who'd have thought when I was reading "anthem" "brave new world" and "farenheit 451" in high school it was really the curriculum of the year after my senior year?


and you wanna know what the real problem is? aside from the zero tolerance and lack of thought process? the whole frelling system's bassackwards, the idiot jocks are adored and worshipped and the intelligencia are pidgeonholed and ridiculed, the only thing that actually made me somewhat popular with some of the "normal" people (mundanes) was the fact I had brains enough to keep them laughing at stuff they didn't notice (IE the driver's ED teacher yelling his brains out at a deaf kid)
they drug the individuality out of the kids, bland the hell out of the textbooks and ply them with standardized test after standardized test to see why they're doing so poorly, and what do they think they need? MORE TESTING TO LEARN BETTER!

THAT my friends is the problem, independant thought is becoming a dirty word in the school system if it isn't already, if you don't believe me, watch the Stephen King classic "Carrie" or the Japanese film "battle royale" and you'll see how badly schools suck

[tribsaint]

You don't need to see a movie to see these things proven. You need only look at any public high school in the country.

I feel very strongly about this, and agree on the jock-thing, but that's for another topic. :)

[TechnoBoY]

Jock thing isnt really a problem at my school! I know a couple of the jocks are really really smart. Cept that just makes people hate them more. lol

[Third EYe]

At the HS I went to in NB Canada, there wasn't really a direct cut between "jocks" and "nerds". There were a few diferent groups. We had "jocks" and we had "nerds" and sometimes they intersected. I for example was a jock and a nerd. We also had "heads", I again fit into that category. We also had the "leather jacket" group, I was in that group as well. There were the "hicks", they weren't considered stupid, there were called such because of where they lived and thier peculiar accent. We had "swaugs", these were a polorized sect, they did rarely mingled with anyone else outside their little group, but they weren't harrassed either.

What I noticed most was the "strong" vs "the weak" and the "popular" vs the "unpopular". I really didn't know it at the time, but I was in the popular group. We were a mix of strong and weak.

I was in the chess club and computer club. I also played soccer, handball, basketball, volleyball, hockey and football for my HS. I got good grades, mostly As and the occassional B. I always had a date for a school dance. I also spent a great deal of time in detention. I think, although I can't prove it, that I spent more time in detention than any other 2 individuals in my school. I was also nominated to run for student council, but I wanted nothing to do with it. I lettered in every sport.

This whole jocks and nerds thing wasn't something I noticed in school. There was one other group, the "heads", and of course I belonged there as well.

Also, it was encouraged that if you played a school sport that you join an accademic club as well. Most did if I remember correctly.

My experience in HS while in Canada was very diferent than that in the US. I arrived at my US HS to find that there were clean cut lines drawn, and they were not to be crossed. Heads were cool, jocks ruled the roost, nerds were picked on, and detention was a black eye on your rep. For the first time in my life, I didn't fit in. I was in AP courses, played school sports, and joined accademic clubs, got detention on a regular basis, smoked pot and drank beer all the time, wore a leather jacket (very bad) and was ultimately rejected by everyone.

One exception to my grades being good. No matter what I did, I could not get a passing grade in Biology. I failed it 3 times.

I found the experience between the 2 schools to be extremely diferent. I don't know why it was like this, but it was. I wonder, is it an American vs Canadian thing?

[AgentSun]

i think there is always a gap between the popular and unpopular. i think it's more of a cultural thing, less of a country thing. and one cannot judge all US high schools based on one, just as you can't judge all Canadian high schools based on one.

the way i see it, there is one basic idea running through all high schools - "be popular or be toast". the popular ones are the ones who do things to "lesser beings" like nerds. the main goal of high school is to be liked and to find a place where you really belong...and that's more of a survival mechanism now, rather than any goal of finding actual friends. kids do it so they won't get picked on, they don't do it so they can find really great life long friends.