OK, Another "What if" Thread...

[NeuralClone]

I was stuck at home for most of last week with the 'flu - and found myself watching a pile of Andromeda DVDs. (Farscape was far too complicated for my fuzzy head!) Anyway, as inevitable, I started noticing how bad the series was as I started to get better. ;) And I thought to myself, "It's a pity, because it has a really neat premise. What if Rockne, DK and Froony were producing it?"

- Dylan Hunt would get beaten up by aliens every episode.
- Tyr really WOULD be treacherous.
- Dave Elsey would be doing the makeup. It would be a hell of a lot better.
- The Andromeda would be hunted by an insane Nietshean or Magog military commander. Or maybe a Nietszchean/Magog hybrid military commander. :grr:
- The female characters would have something to do besides look sexy.


Anyway, this is a thread for picking any second rate/mediocre/done to death TV show, and wondering what our team would make of it. Star Trek, anyone? :D

[Famira Damaris]

Dear God, I have to agree with you on Andromada. It's just....bad. Beyond that even. Corny-as-hell dialogue, smarmy, none of the characters strike me as likeable. >< That, and when you're watching it, you keep thinking you've seen it before.

[bouyantman]

i too watched it when it first came out and thought it was pretty good....but then it did get kinda dull after a while so i stopped watching it.....seems like i did the right thing

[JrMissToughChick]

I love this Thread I am Starting to hate Andromeda I liked it at first but then it realy did get bad and I love that I am not alone in my thoughts :) I wished it could have been beter it did have a good premise, and I am loveing all your "what ifs"

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[shamecube]

My best friend loves both Farscape and Andromeda. He made me watch it the other day and I was completely speechless. The show just seems lazy to me. It looks like everyone is phoning in their work, even the writers.

[RydraWong]

The deal with Andromeda seems to be that they fired the head writer and showrunner for wanting to do scary complicated stuff like plots lasting longer than one ep, having actual ideas in the show, expecting the viewer to use more than one brain cell, etc.

See http://www.slipstreamnews.com/news/231101_01.shtml for the grisly details.

[jeffrabb]

Yes, the cast and crew have made no bones about that. In fact, from what I understand many of them are Farscape fans and have been very supportive of us.

Jeff

[RydraWong]

Poor guys ...

The one thing worse than having your show cancelled: having it renewed but destroyed :(.

[FieryHands]

I liked the show in the beginning, hoping that unlike Earth: Final Conflict, it'd get better as the series went by. But I was disappointed and gave up on it around the second season. There is just one episode I liked in the first season when Andromeda came across its sister ship filled with android copies of its crew. That was actually good. But since then, I can only bear to watch it if there's a SG guest star or if James Marsters in it. Dylan seems too "space hero guy" and Harper irritated me with his 20th/21st century slang. What century where they supposed to be in anyway?

I did like Tyr. He never got any good storylines though. The budget would be excusable if the storylines weren't so medicore.

[Egg]

Originally posted by Famira Damaris
Dear God, I have to agree with you on Andromada. It's just....bad. Beyond that even. Corny-as-hell dialogue, smarmy, none of the characters strike me as likeable. >< That, and when you're watching it, you keep thinking you've seen it before.

Hercules in Space. Fulfils it methinks..................

[JrMissToughChick]

who's James Marsters? I know thats a stupid question. I liked the ones with MS in it those were pretty good.

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[FieryHands]

James Marsters is the guy who plays Spike on Buffy & Angel.

[JrMissToughChick]

What ep was he in?

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[FieryHands]

"Into the Labyrinth" as Charlmagne Bolivar, season 2.

[ipimen]

i also started watching andromeda and kept on watching until the middle of S3. I was never utterly fascinated by the show, but from time to time it had something interesting to offer.

Harper is so frelling annoying. And i like Tyr as a character but the (over)actor that plays him is so bad that i just can't stand him. I also started to hate Dylan's childish attitude, maybe with some more maturity he would be a better captain, or maybe with another actor :rolleyes:

I think that the change for storyline of Trance was good, dunno if they have kept it good. I like the future golden trance better than the present purple one.

Well that's about it. Dunno what the Farscape crew could do with this premise, my imagination is not that great, that's why i watch tv :D

[nightmare42]

What if Stargate was made by the Farscape crew?
-they would have more aliens- because it´s so boring that everyone looks human! Some aliens with tentacles, and a lot more leather!
- they lack a few "grey" characters- someone that isn´t entirely good or evil! Someone like Rygel, or the early Chiana!
-the one with the ugly lips wouldn´t be in it!
-and of course, RDA isn´t sexy enough!
-the dialogue wouldn´t be so long and boring- and the main character would be beaten up a lot! By friend and foe!

It would have to be quite the opposite of now!

[brokendj23]

i try and steer clear of anything kevin sorbo (is that his name?)
"YES I THINK IT IS"
thank u neural clone in my head

[FieryHands]

Stargate slips by even with everyone magically speaking english on every planet and every world all looking strikingly like Earth or just like the last episode on, (weren't we just in this forest last week?) but Andromeda is just bad, period. Stargate has its own comfortable niche, lacking in certain areas what makes Farscape excellent, but at least you can watch three random episodes without having hugely strong emotional reaction ruins your concentration when you're working on something (i.e. breaking into laughter or crying). Its good "filler" TV.

[Frunium Slip]

Originally posted by RydraWong
The deal with Andromeda seems to be that they fired the head writer and showrunner for wanting to do scary complicated stuff like plots lasting longer than one ep, having actual ideas in the show, expecting the viewer to use more than one brain cell, etc.

And skiffy didn't have anything to do with it?

[JrMissToughChick]

On the FAQ on stargates web site it said

Q:why do all the people an Stargate speak english?
A: They don't Daniel Jackson Translates for them.

Whatever!

They arn't exact quotes but you get the point.

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[Famira Damaris]

*snrks*

[B Sharp]

Originally posted by nightmare42

-the one with the ugly lips wouldn´t be in it!


:spew: wha.....? OK, I'll admit I don't really watch it very often, but to whom are you referring here?

[Famira Damaris]

Gotta wonder the same thing.

[JrMissToughChick]

I have no clue and I use to watch stargate.

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[Ouroboros]

If the Farscape crew ran Andromeda Geharis Rhade would have won the fight.

The show from then on with him trying to put back together what his trechery had destroyed would be much more meanigful almost automatically. His interactions with Tyr alone would be worth it. They could even drag it out for a few years before he finally admitted to his crew what really happened on the bridge that day and confroted his guilt over what he'd done. The fact Steve Basic is both more likeable and interesting than Sorbo and wouldn't hijack the show to turn it into Kirkules would see Andromeda become one of the better Sci-fi programs of our era.

And skiffy didn't have anything to do with it?

Actually from what I've read that's more or less what they wanted for the new reworked Farscape.

[FieryHands]

Yes! I think Andromeda had that epsiode where he survived and frelled up the universe. Huh. I always wished he'd survived though. Even having him alive and keeping everything else the same might have helped just a *little*.

[JrMissToughChick]

Yeah I liked Rhade Better than Cpt. Hunt too.
I think he's on it right now on the newer eps
not Geharis its another Rhade though

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[FieryHands]

As long as its the same actor...

[JrMissToughChick]

It's for the Good of the show, it will boost Rateings, People love him Reasons why they put him in ;)

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[FieryHands]

Glad they have some sense!

[nightmare42]

-the one with the ugly lips wouldn´t be in it!

I mean this guy: Teal'c, I don´t like him!

[witchdoctor]

Originally posted by nightmare42
What if Stargate was made by the Farscape crew?
-they would have more aliens- because it´s so boring that everyone looks human! Some aliens with tentacles, and a lot more leather!
- they lack a few "grey" characters- someone that isn´t entirely good or evil! Someone like Rygel, or the early Chiana!
-the one with the ugly lips wouldn´t be in it!
-and of course, RDA isn´t sexy enough!
-the dialogue wouldn´t be so long and boring- and the main character would be beaten up a lot! By friend and foe!

It would have to be quite the opposite of now!

Yes, there are quite a few human appearing aliens, but at least there is a rationale for that within the series premise. The Ga'auld (spelling massacre here, sorry) took humans from ancient Earth and used them widely for slaves and labor through out their empire, according to the back story. Therefore there is a logical and internally consistant reason to be finding human types all over the place.

I agree with you on the lack of grey characters though. They do have greys , though not what you were talking about. :D

I like watching Stargate from time to time, but I have been irritated with some inconsistancies with the Major Carter character. On the one hand she is military and opporational/field military at that, but some of the decisions her character makes run totally counter to that. For example, in one episode several weeks back, all the stargates were down, or at least travel back to earth was, due to some kind of computer virus. She travels with one other scientist to try and get them back on-line, but didn't take any other personnel with her because she wanted to spare them from the danger. That is NOT how the military works. If there is a mission and a certain amount and complement of personnel are required for its success, you don't leave them behind because you are concerned it might be dangerous. You might ask for volunteers, but you don't jeopardize the success of the mission by going solo when a team is needed. If she is military, she should realize that. There are other episodes fwhere she makes decisions for personal reasons that I don't find believable due to her military background and the military nature of their missions.

[witchdoctor]

Hmmmm, I've never seen Andromeda and wondered if it were worthwhile, but from what I have read in this thread and particularly in the link to the slipstream site about the change in writers and creative direction, it sounds like a waste.

[Famira Damaris]

Heh, just watch the little previews they have on the Farscape DVDs. :p It'll spare you having to watch an episode.

[Ouroboros]

Hmmmm, I've never seen Andromeda and wondered if it were worthwhile, but from what I have read in this thread and particularly in the link to the slipstream site about the change in writers and creative direction, it sounds like a waste.

Season one is worth watching as well as early season two. Just stop before you hit the episode the bears my namesake. That's when they fired their creative staff and began the first of a series of character butcheries. It all goes down hill from there.

[Weetabix]

I forced myself to watch the pilot of Andromeda when it aired on French TV cable, and God it was hard. I kicked myself to go on with the second part and when it was over I knew I would never bother to watch another episode.
Especially when there is farscape. When you have tasted the better, you can't go back to lesser quality (is there any ?)

I had the same problem with Mutant X which is as bad as Andromeda. Characters (actors ?) with no charisma, not an ounce of chemistry on screen, no emotion, no...well nothing.
Nothing happens on the screen and... *yawn*

As for Stargate...There's been more evolution (at all levels) in 4 years of Farscape than 8 years of SG1. When I watch an episode from time to time, I feel like I'm watching the same story again and again. It's not really hard to catch up. It has always kept thing on a superficial level, and you don't really care or feel for the characters.

[nightmare42]

Especially when there is farscape. When you have tasted the better, you can't go back to lesser quality (is there any ?)


I have to agree it´s hard. But when you eventually watched every ep of Farscape (2 or more times!) you yearn for something you don´t know yet! And therefore you try, and try....
But really good scifi is very rare. I force myself to watch other series too. But I could never watch Stargate, or (and I think it´s a shame that Buffy and Angel are mixed up with real scifi- it´s nothing to do with Farscape!) other dren!:O

[fiona-maria]

O, you guys got me going with this one!*grin* This is a long reply, bear with me, I have a lot to say, for once.*laugh*

James Marsters was the only person I actually enjoyed watching from Buffy (though I think Anthony what's'is'name Head is quite nice-looking), and now Angel. Marsters is the first American I have heard do a believeable English accent. (Don't get me started on Dick van Dyke, OK?*Sheesh* WHAT a disaster his accent was in Mary Poppins!)

Andromeda had a great premise, and then, the second season it sort of imploded into some solipsistic ego-boo vehicle for Sorbo. REALLY unfortunate, they could have done some really great things with it, but they took the easy way out.

I find the guy who plays Tyr to be one of the better actors on the show, and I enjoy the character of Harper. But Trance is DEFINITELY underutilised as a character, and the show itself has degenerated into a series of storylines where explosions and fistfights seem to take the place of dialogue and character development.

Stargate I have a lot of the same problems with. I thought the film was really quite good (heck, even my mother thought it was good, and she is very critical). The first season was fun, and I enjoyed being able to sit and watch Stargate the entire evening on Mondays on Sci Fi.

Of them all, I find the guy who plays Teal'c to be the better actor on the show. It looks like he has some stagecraft (though that Michael Shanks is surely very pretty). I have seen him do some very subtle stuff. A lot of the "overacting" is, I think, a function of the writing, the script these people are handed.

But it doesn't seem like there is any movement in terms of character development or evolution, they are still playing the same people they were when they started, and the planets they visit do not seem unearthly. I realise we are talking about that very narrow bandwidth in terms of what will support life as we know it, but still. FarScape had some very unearthly places that they went to.

I loved Babylon 5. I thought that was really good TV, and I was sorry to see it go. Though the last season was getting very dark and very violent, which made it hard for me to watch.

Mutant X is boring. Ho hum. Buffy, I can't watch demons getting slain all the time, it makes me tres ennuyee, besides getting desensitised to violence.

So, if Stargate was more like FarScape, what's'is'name, Anderson, would be having an affair with Carter (we know there is some sexual tension there, they have made it SO obvious*sigh*), and some of what we would be seeing would be the results of those actions and their efforts to be discreet about it, seeing as there is that whole "non-fraternisation" thing they are supposed to do (and you KNOW that it happens ANYway).

The guy who plays Jackson would find himself falling in love with another woman for real, not just attraction or horniness, and trying to deal with his feelings of guilt for falling in love with someone else when he thinks he should be "faithful" to his dead wife.

Teal'c would have decided he is not a warrior in his heart, had a revolt of conscience and gone to the higher evolved planet (where that guy who played Quark on ST: DS9, Armin Schimmerman, was), to zen out and be at peace. he really wants to be in harmony with himself and the universe, but he finds it very difficult to forgive himself for all the violence he has perpetrated in the name of peace.

The Go'a'uld would have successfully suborned someone in the SG program, or in the American military system, or the American political one, but no one would know it for a while, and it would make all KINDS of trouble for everyone.

We would start seeing lots more non-humanoid characters. We would run into some differnt types of human societies, seeing as the Go'a'uld took humans from all over and all different eras.

Ok, idea here. So, how about some Celtic christian pagans, with high priestesses from two different churches arguing about the temporal and poltical power each of them has, and SG1 suddenly walks into this, and Carter and Jack find themselves on different sides, only this time, because Carter and Jack are lovers as well as officers in the US military, it gets really funky and dirty with the power struggle, and Carter refuses to subsume her ethical principles just because Jack says she is supposed to because he is her superior officer? And this places a strain on their personal relationship as well as their professional one?

Anyway. I've said enough for now. Back to work.*grin*

Fiona

[FieryHands]

Who wouldn't want to see that on Stargate? I'd like to add that Jonas wouldn't have been shipped home but stayed around on the base, part of another team or something. They had to get rid of him when I was getting fond of him.

So, someone actually sat through the *entire* pilot of Mutant X? I couldn't get through the first ten minutes! The moment I saw the guy dancing on the bank teller counter like he was in rock video and I tuned out. I am more likely to sit through two Andromeda episodes than to EVER watch Mutant X. And damn it, I like mutants!

Angel and Buffy are included because currently the fantasy/occult genre is tiny, old shows aside (I don't count Charmed as *anything* but bad TV), and Farscape isn't really strictly scifi (in the sense that Babylon 5 is) and the three shows are actually *good* quality and have similiar wit in writing and character development.

I think though, my Dad is more critical than anyone has the right to be about what's on TV. He considers everything not a BBC show he likes crap, including the news (he's kinda right there). I was stunned when he complimented Sarah Michelle Gellar on her performance in the last Buffy episode when she said goodbye to Spike--that was surreal. :faint: But he saw Unrealized Reality, instead of asking what was going on on, he ranted about how John Crichton has this incredible knowledge, been all over the universe but he's blue collar and shouldn't be constantly using American slang when the aliens shouldn't understand it, blah, blah, blah...I guess he'd been played by a brit he'd be happier. So, he enjoys Red Dwarf and Doctor Who but falls asleep right before they start.

Yeesh. And also, he thinks Stargate is absolute crap. I think though, even *he* recognizes that Farscape has better writing. It may be he just doesn't like American TV and is biased towards Farscape because there's one American actor. He likes Zhaan, but I question why. He keeps grumbling about how women don't wear dresses anymore...heh heh. And he wonders why I why won't let him buy me a frelling skirt.

Anyway, for anyone who can sit through a TV program with a family member and not have to listen to complaining--I envy you. On the upside, if Andromeda or Stargate is on, we both can rant and its bonding. :D

[Selena]

Originally posted by witchdoctor
Hmmmm, I've never seen Andromeda and wondered if it were worthwhile, but from what I have read in this thread and particularly in the link to the slipstream site about the change in writers and creative direction, it sounds like a waste.
If you get the opportunity to watch the first 2 seasons do so ... they were really fun and quite enjoyable. No-one was really sure who was friend or foe and the Magog were truly nasty. I really loved the first 2 or 3 seasons. It's only the last year that the show has started to go really weird and seems to have lost its way.
And like Farscape the hero (Dylan) gets beat up almost every episode. :lol

[fiona-maria]

FieryHands, you're right, Jonas did not get enough to do around there before he was sent to wherever he went.*smile*

I reckon he should have fallen in love with Carter, and carried a really bad jones for her, and it would eat him up seeing Jack and Carter carry on when they thought no one was looking.*grin*

Fiona

[Weetabix]

Originally posted by FieryHands
So, someone actually sat through the *entire* pilot of Mutant X? I couldn't get through the first ten minutes! Oh I don't know how I did it. When I saw the Andy Wharol wannabe I fought hard not to run away screaming :D


I enjoyed watching Buffy all those years. There was this quality that brought some really nice tv moments, like there are in Farscape.
Some "moments of grace", when everything fit in place : acting, writing, emotion...I mean you empathize with what's going on.
That's what I miss in so many shows (and movies).

[JrMissToughChick]

I listen to Mutant X I don't watch it funny I usely have a I GOTA WATCH WHAT I'M WATCHING mindset but oh well.

Much Love,
~JrMTC~

[FieryHands]

Its funny how there are shows we just "listen to" while there are others we have to have our eyes glued on the TV for the whole hour. If it doesn't engage the full attention, what's the point?

Then again, some of us have problems with concentration and must do ten different things at the same time in order to stay completely focused. Like *ahem* me.

[JrMissToughChick]

Background noise ;)

~JrMTC~

[Scaper989]

Let's see what they might have done with Joe Schmo.

* Hutch "the asshole" would come out of the closet and admit
he's gay.

* Kip "the gay guy" would be irritated by this and turn into
"the asshole".

* One of the girls would be twins, but "Joe" wouldn't be told
this. Every other day would be a different twin. "Joe" would
quickly begin to wonder about her sanity.

* Instead of just having a crush on the host, one of the girls
would have slept with him. Then, the other would have. Then,
they would have slept with each other.

* Eventually, they'd get so over the top that "Joe" would
figure it out for himself on camera, instead of them telling him.


I really liked Joe Schmo, but think the Farscape creative team
could have made it even more interesting.

[Famira Damaris]

*snrks*

[NeuralClone]

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned some of the recent Trek series - "Voyager" anyone? "Enterprise"?

Or do you think that they're so far beyond help that even Rockne and DK couldn't save them? ;D

[jeffrabb]

Originally posted by NeuralClone
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned some of the recent Trek series - "Voyager" anyone? "Enterprise"?

Or do you think that they're so far beyond help that even Rockne and DK couldn't save them? ;D

Something like that:duck:

Jeff

[Famira Damaris]

Haven't really followed Voyager or Enterprise.