How far in time did he travel?

[Roland]

I was wondering how far in time you guys think JC traveled when he first got shot through the worm hole in Premiere. I haven't given it much thought, but they have not hinted on how far in time he have journeyed, only that he has done it. But it must be quite a time leap considering the tile from WWS.

What do you think? :)

[JrMissToughChick]

Hmm I thought he traveled in space not time.

[Roland]

Well, space also of course. ;)

[Jeff O'Connor]

Wait Roland, when did they say he traveled in time at all? I missed that part, maybe in UR? I missed that whole episode and am still wishing I didn't...

[JrMissToughChick]

Originally posted by Roland
Well, space also of course. ;) well if and I say IF he did and also asuming and I say ASSUMING Sebaceans are realy humans... I'd say atleast 100,000 years

[Jeff O'Connor]

Wait, Sebaceans are Humans!? That's one I considered, but never really canceled out, though... found a very strange idea in... neat... but I still don't know exactly where the hints toward time-travel really were.

[JrMissToughChick]

NONE

[Jeff O'Connor]

Well obviously Roland thinks there were, and I've heard others saying they thought so too. Are you sure there weren't any?

[Roland]

It says so on the DVD covers! ;) So I'd say it would be the case. :)

[StephX]

I thought maybe Sebaceans were humans taken from Earth sometime in the past (our present day their past maybe?) by the Goddess (aliens?) Aeryn was talking about in the ep. "Prayer".

Maybe they were Scarrens (since they seem to enjoy experiementing on people) or something and they genetically altered humans so that they would have heat delirium, better eyesight and such.

[Jeff O'Connor]

Whoa... shows how little I've had the chance to see the DVD Covers. What does it say!?

[Roland]

I was working on a synopsis for season 1 for my web page using the season 1 DVD's (reg 2), and got reminded of it. I had forgotten about it. I remember posting about it a couple of months ago, but nobody replied back then I think.

It says: bla bla bla astonaut John Crichton is swept across time and space into a far region of the universe. bla bla bla...

[NYPinTA]

That has to be a mistake, because I am pretty sure that he does not travel forward in time at all. I think both Rockne O'Bannon has said it as well as DK... but I can't remember where so as to give you links.
He travels through space alone as far as I recall.
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But there are hints that Sebaceans and Humans are related. Crais hints at it when he first comes aboard Moya at the end of S1, and later when John finds that toy due to his first introduction to Granny Drugs....

Edit: What I meant by "Sebaceans and Humans are related..." I meant like allies or associates, not genetically related. Sorry about that. Like maybe at one time Humans and Sebaceans had dealings with one another, and then something bad, something I would very much like to see explored in new episodes of Farscape... happened.

[NYPinTA]

Found one, right here on FMD!

http://www.watchfarscape.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22265

"O'Bannon's most successful series, "Farscape," not only ran on cable's Sci Fi channel (for four seasons) but also was conspicuously not set in the future. Ben Browder played a contemporary space shuttle astronaut vaulted into alien regions of space, where he coped with culture shock by quoting rock lyrics and TV shows from the same frame of reference as his 1999-2003 audience.”

I guess though that they could be refering to John Crichton not from the future and not that he didn't go there...
Frell. Inconclusive.
Sorry. ;)

[witchdoctor]

This idea came up in a thread titled "what Galaxy is JC in?" It is about 200 posts long, but somewhere in there the idea that John traveled not across the galaxy but also forward in time and that Humans became the PK's. It was an interesting thread.

Here is a link:
http://www.watchfarscape.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15752&highlight=time+galaxy

[Roland]

Originally posted by witchdoctor
This idea came up in a thread titled "what Galaxy is JC in?" It is about 200 posts long, but somewhere in there the idea that John traveled not across the galaxy but also forward in time and that Humans became the PK's. It was an interesting thread.

Here is a link:
http://www.watchfarscape.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15752&highlight=time+galaxy

That's my theory also. That Humans became Sebaceans after leaving earth. ;)

[Jeff O'Connor]

And Interons are in there somewhere too... I wonder how?

[NYPinTA]

I'm sticking with my first answer though, that he didn't travel in time. :)
But the idea the humans become PKs doesn't wouldn't really surprise me- if that is what is revealed to have happened.

[The Keeper]

Originally posted by JrMissToughChick
well if and I say IF he did and also asuming and I say ASSUMING Sebaceans are realy humans... I'd say atleast 100,000 years

Thats a really cool theory JRMTC. :aok:

I like it!

Also, just wondering here...what if they actually put something along these lines into the Mini series?

Interesting...

[Chryse]

In one of the early chats Kemper said straight out that John did not travel in time, just space.

Any speculation about Humans, Sebaceans and Interons being related is just that, speculation. There has never been any direct mention of it in any ep. There has been discussion in the past about divergent evolution creating species in distant locales that are similar in many respects. There has also been speculation that since John did not travel in time, the relation between the races are due to the Ancients moving an ancestor species to various worlds that since evolved in different directions. It's anyone's guess as to where the original ancestor species came from though.

edited to add
Just to be clear... while there has been mention from time to time in the eps that the 3 species look like they are related, there hasn't been anything definitive. Tocot (the doctor on the ice world) had highly advanced medical technology and knowledge that solved the problem of organ rejection when the possibility of using Interon material was brought up. But they never actually said that Interons and Humans were related, just that it was the closest match in their organ bank to John.

And let's not forget in DNA Mad Scientist, Namtar was unable to find a match for John's DNA in his data banks, which were supposed to be the most extensive in reasonable distance.

The existence of Sebacian hybrids (Scorpius and Jothee) actually make the strongest case for an ancestor species that is most closely Sebacian than any other because it seems to be the most hybridizable of the species.

As for John's daughter in LATP and Aeryn's pregnancy, both Katralla and Aeryn's DNA had been altered, possibly to the extent that neither could mate with other Sebaceans but could now have a more likely hybrid child with John.

Also, one disclaimer... all these ideas are NOT mine. I'm remembering discussion from the past, probably when the eps were first aired, from posts on the Dom, from Valdron, Microdoc, godallmitey, BadMagumbo and others.

[Jeff O'Connor]

The Ancestor Species Relocation idea reminds me of the Stargate system with the Goa'uld, but I really like it... and besides, like in many threads lately it should be mentioned that all these ideas have their roots well before the modern generations of science fiction.

[Grippy]

I know and am not debating what Rockne and such have said, but if my tiny memory of science stuff is intact, CAN you travel in space without travelling in time? Even a little? The two are so interrelated, (us being 4th dimensional beings after all) that I don't think you can totally cut the two apart. :D :kitty: Just a thought from my little corner.

[Jeff O'Connor]

That is correct, as the stars we see are supposedly in the past and whatnot, it's the "lightspeed theory" if you will... but perhaps wormholes override that?

[JrMissToughChick]

Originally posted by The Keeper
Thats a really cool theory JRMTC. :aok:

I like it!

Also, just wondering here...what if they actually put something along these lines into the Mini series?

Interesting... Sorry not really my theory It's just how long it'd take is all... I think they could be related but I doubt they are the same I have A compleatly different theory my self may post later

[Ouroboros]

The DVD cover probably just ment space-time by the guy added to much flair to it.

If they're going to do a relocation story then Earth will have to be the point of origen just like in Stargate. We have a fossil record of our evolution here so we can't be said to have just fallen out of a spaceship.

I'd imagine it would burn both the PK's and Interion's collective asses to learn they were both descended from our "inferior" race and related to each other.

[Otto the Mild]

I always thought it would be cool if it turned out that JC had been shot waaaay into the future (100K+ years). Instead of just the Sebaceans being descended from humans, have several other species be derived from humans via genetic manipulation. Luxans, Delvians, Nebari, all would turn out to be descended from humanity. This idea crossed my mind thanks to the Hyperion novels, which include a race of humans that has manipulated their genes so much that they only vaguely resemble humans.

But, I don't write for the show, so frell that...

[Jeff O'Connor]

That's a really good idea, I've thought of before too. Also, I forget who it was, it could've been JRMTC but the theory that Scarrans evolved from dinosaurs was a really far-flung and impressive notion. The thing about the descending from Humans into multiple species though... just how many races out there would be from us? All of them and it would seem far too unbelievable. Some would be good, but circumstance is too strong and presient here. Only one of two things could explain the happenstance of Human-descended races ending up on Moya.

1.) It just sort've happened! Ahaha! Look at the time, better fly! (In otherwords a lame 'wow, what a coincedence' type situation.)

2.) (And I think a tad better) It was pre-ordained by someone or something to reunite multiple Human-descended races with their ancestor for some "unearthly" reason.

[akshunj]

Weren't Crichton and Jool supposed to be of similar species? Or at least genetically compatible with no pre-manipulation. That's got to imply some sort of common ancestor...

--Akshun J

[NYPinTA]

hmm....
I don't think it will turn out that humans are the origins of most of the species that John has run into... and I am basing that idea on the 'toy' he found with a recongnizable human symbol. To me, that means that at one point a few races on the side of the galaxy John is in included humans and considering how behind the times our race seems to be in the Farscape Universe that some of those humans that had dealings with the other aliens then came to Earth.. or got stranded... or were sent away like Earth was a penal colony...

[witchdoctor]

I think that some kind of connection between the Human, Sebacean and Intiron species has been implied, though what that is has been left open. The artifact found on Arnessk with the Intiron, Sebacean and Egyption symbols certainly implied a connection, as well the statement that the priests of Arnessk served a role in holding together these different groups. What that connection actually turns out to be is still open.

[witchdoctor]

My feeling is that what this connection is will be explored to some extent in the mini-series, but this is just my opinion. The crew and Moya may go to Arnessk to pick up Jool. Alternatively, Jool could be forced to leave Arnessk due to Scarran or PK pressure and seek out Crichton et al for help. True, the PK's and Scarrans weren't directly after her, but she was associated with them and I could see either group employing guilt by association or else thinking they could get to Crichton through Jool. It is really up to the writers how they want to bring in Jool, but I think she will be reunited with the crew somehow.

[Jeff O'Connor]

As much as I'm sure most of us would want a huge blast of a revelation, I seem to remember David Kemper playing it fairly cool with the radio broadcast I heard him on, saying it was "just another plot thread to be addressed later on". Of course now that if all goes down the miniseries could be last of Farscape to be made, I'm pretty sure him and Rockne would aim toward it with vehemence given that, frankly, it's one of the largest things us Scapers are looking forward to.

[Clarsax]

Originally posted by NYPinTA
I'm sticking with my first answer though, that he didn't travel in time. :)
But the idea the humans become PKs doesn't wouldn't really surprise me- if that is what is revealed to have happened.

I don't think he could have traveled in time without some big inconsistency. If he traveled in the past and then came back to Earth, its possible that his earlier self would still be there. And I think Jack Crichton talked about how many years John had been gone at one point. What would be interesting is if he traveled to some alternate reality and never realized it.

With the humans and PKs, its also possible that long ago a ship of Sebaceans had an accident and crashlanded on Earth. Maybe thier particular group spoke ancient Egyptian and some of thier human descendents continued to use it.

[Darth Buddha]

The show is set in the present insofar as it's protagonist. But wormholes don't see to be bound to the same time at both ends, so what are the odds he came out exactly the same time. What is the default for a wormholle? After all, in Kansas he wound up at different time.. no biggie.

But to argue against it... if Sebaceans are descended from human stock, wouldn't Aeryn showing up on earth create an Unrealized Reality?

[JrMissToughChick]

But to argue against it... if Sebaceans are descended from human stock, wouldn't Aeryn showing up on earth create an Unrealized Reality?
Like a movie I saw once... a women goes back in time and Marries her ancestor later they find out that she was also her ancestor... No big
.

[Jeff O'Connor]

Those potentials in the universe always tend to frighten the frell out of me.

[JrMissToughChick]

Originally posted by Jeff O'Connor
Those potentials in the universe always tend to frighten the frell out of me. :rollin: I haven't laughed this hard scence the underware joke :rollin:

[Jeff O'Connor]

Yeah, the underwear joke rocked! Wow, talk about inside jokes in threads that have nothing to do with either of said inside jokes. ;)

[JrMissToughChick]

:rollin: ;)

[marandken]

IMHO: I don't think that Sebaceans are humans because my memory remembers that each time there was a story where JC's DNA was analyzed, it was completely different from Sebs. If there were some evolutionary connection, there would be some DNA similarities. After all, we're about 1-2 DNA strands away from dogs.

I don't think it matters if he went to a different time. You know that wormholes distort time/space so being out of time seems irrelevant to me personally.

As Daniel Pinkwater says in "Borgle" : Time is like a bagel, or a map of the state of New Jersey. (Great book BTW)

[JrMissToughChick]

Originally posted by marandken
IMHO: I don't think that Sebaceans are humans because my memory remembers that each time there was a story where JC's DNA was analyzed, it was completely different from Sebs. If there were some evolutionary connection, there would be some DNA similarities. After all, we're about 1-2 DNA strands away from dogs (Great book BTW) Yeah but we know he is related to Jool's Race and I think Namtar would have had her's down... I think it's because Namtar analised at the sub-Atomic tripple helix... I think thats what he said... I don't think there is a one but it made for a good story though

[Spedoinkel]

Originally posted by NYPinTA
But there are hints that Sebaceans and Humans are related. Crais hints at it when he first comes aboard Moya at the end of S1, and later when John finds that toy due to his first introduction to Granny Drugs....

Yes but the toy had both ancient Sebacean, and Egyptian Hieroglyphs.

This leads to Sebeaceans not being human.

[NYPinTA]

Oh.. when I said 'related' I meant that they maybe associated with one another. Not 'related' in the genetic sense. Sorry.
But wait.. what did Crais mean then??! He didn't seem surprised that Humans looked just like Sebaceans.... like he knew something but didn't say....
Frell.. now I have a headache. I was argueing they were not related, (even if I wasn't clear about it. :lol ) Now.. I am not so sure.

[Spedoinkel]

It's just a freaky coinsidence. and a way for Farscape to save on makeup.

[akshunj]

Recall that Aeryn is pregnant and Crichton is the father. That implies a HIGH degree of genetic similarity. As closely related as we are to all other mammals on earth, we can only breed with other humans. Right? My wife is a geneticist and I'm sort of embarrassed to not be sure about that statement, but she's not around so I can't cheat and ask her...

--Akshun J

[Spedoinkel]

Umm well what about the Sebecean/Luxan and Sebecean/Scarren hybrids, hmmm?

By your reasoning they all have similar genetics.

[Diania]

Spoiler of season 4
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Well, according to the episode, Kansas, wormholes do go through time. The crew of Moya went to Earth when John was younger. If they traveled time through Wormhole Express, I wonder what timely adventures lay before them in the Miniseries and hopefully season 5?

[Clarsax]

It could be interesting, now that they know how to travel through time using wormholes. With what John knows, they could pretty much travel to any time period in any unrealized reality as long as they could figure out how to navigate.

[Spedoinkel]

That is exactly what the Ancients were trying to prevent.

[Chryse]

re: Hybrids and Aeryn's Baby
That Sebacians, Scarrens, Luxans, et all are related is pretty obvious from the hybrid children they are able to bear. This is why there is speculation that they are all descended from a common "parent" species.

Aeryn's baby, fathered by John, is another matter altogther. Recall that Aeryn's DNA was altered by Namtar in DNA Mad Scientist. This alteration, while reversed, was not completely undone. It's this alteration that makes the two of them fertile.

This was strengthened in LATP when John was found to be very compatible with Katralla, who's DNA was "poisoned" by her brother Clayvor. But when John is kissing all those other girls in the club with the Kissing Drops, the Drops showed that he WASN'T particularly compatible with ordinary Sebacean women.

RE: Wormholes in Kansas
Wormholes are able to travel through both time and space but necessarily at the same time. Wormholes can travel through space only, time only or both space and time. John's wormhole in the Premiere only traveled through space, as Kemper has said on various occasions.

[Spedoinkel]

Hmm, I had forgoten about the Katralla thing.

So John can only hook up with the defective models?